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Darin's picture

Minor move, but interesting

The Panthers claimed former third-round pick Charles Spencer off waivers from Houston, giving them another interesting option in camp.

The 6-foot-4, 337-pound tackle from Pitt, hasn't played since suffering a serious knee injury in the second game of the 2006 season. The Texans got tired of waiting for him to recover.

If he's well, he's a potential upgrade. If he's not, it costs nothing. It also gets them back to even, since the Texans claimed former Panthers third-round tackle Rashad Butler off waivers a year ago, and think they can make something off the narrow-in-the-seat Miami product.

If nothing else, Spencer's the right size, and worth a look. To make room for him on the roster, they waived T Rueben Riley, who spent last year on the practice squad.

This is tied to Gross' contract negotiations

This is a possible replacement for Gross if we can't get him to re-sign. If he's ready to practice, great. If not, PUP him and you've got him when you need him next year.

I think Otah IS a eventual LT, unlike the god-like football scout Procton.

Michaelprocton's picture

Why?

Your LT needs to be your best pass blocker. He needs to be intelligent and quick to analyze the on-field situation. He needs to have good agility and footwork to shut down NFL-caliber speed rushers. Otah is really strong and good in the run game, but he possesses none of these qualities.
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Always remember...don't let FACTS get in the way of your argument...

Bubblesthechimp's picture

Gross Insurance and Rashad Butler Revenge

Why didnt Texans just PUP him, with full intentions of putting him on IR??? It's a easy move, watch and learn Texans.

Charles Spencer will be IR'd along with Geoff Schwartz(sheltonidis). Hard choices need to be made, Panthers can't keep Pep, Gross, AND Gamble. Each will get loads of cash thrown at them if free. Now they have two good backup plans if they lose two of them(Gross and Gamble). So that leaves Pep and I dont think Hilee Taylor is the second coming of LT. Sad thing, I dont believe Pep is worth the number he wants or will command form other teams. I hope Panthers can tag Pep, then trade him thus getting back a 2009 1st pick with others.

Michaelprocton's picture

FA questions

I agree, we should be no worse than this year if we move Wharton back out to LT if Gross leaves (unless he's suddenly learned to be better than adequate on the left side.) I don't think Otah or Spencer are LTs.
EDIT: Spencer apparently WAS starting at LT for the Texans in the two games before he got hurt, but had been a guard in college.

I think the decision at CB is pretty clear cut. Let Gamble go and restructure Lucas, or keep Gamble, cut Lucas, and give Gamble that money.

I don't think we can franchise Pep for fear that he doesn't find a deal he likes and takes the money. The tag would guarantee him a 20% raise since he's already got the highest cap number of any team in football, and that'd be $16+ mil. You just can't plan around that kind of hit for one guy, and I know from experience as a Braves fan. The Braves offered Greg Maddux arbitration just hoping to get draft picks, but he and his agent took it, and the Braves were screwed. That was why they had to trade Kevin Millwood for pennies on the dollar. Anyways, the point is, we can't keep Peppers on the roster at what his number will be, and his performance doesn't merit the kind of contract he wants. Very interesting to me, too, that we're offering the same contract we were last summer.

Oh, and just for interest's sake, why do you mention Hilee Taylor (a 235-oounder who's supposedly a DE--who I don't ever even think will be a consistent rotation player-- without noting McClover and Johnson? I think people are really down on Johnson, but I'm not sure why. Yes, McClover will likely never be a starter, but at least he's got a high motor and competitive drive. After we saw what could happen with Jeff King's redshirt year, I believe Johnson could step into the starting lineup and produce. He looked good the last couple games, showing more fight off the line than Peppers did all year and putting some pressure on the QB. Also, that'd let us keep Brayton as the DE/DT swing guy, even though everybody keeps harping on how he just needs to play one position.
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Always remember...don't let FACTS get in the way of your argument...

Bubblesthechimp's picture

I will not go to far into

I will not go to far into this, but facts are Wharton is a better LT than Gross. Which is why I'm still confused with the current OL. I believe Panthers put Gross out there as a test. Rolling the dice in hopes of lowering his value some.

By no means wound I consider paying Pep tag money. NO. It would just be a way to hold his rights until the right deal comes down. Just like the Jarred Allen situation was in KC.

DE insurance doest have the numbers of OL, nor a stud-in-waiting like CB. If Pep leaves future looks dark for DEs. McClover is RFA this year. Brayton is proven underachiever at this stage. Hilee is a 3-4 LB. I do some more faith in Charles Johnson than most. I believes CJ wins the LDE this TC. Adding all that up means Pep has the upper hand come contract talks. Pep is the only proven player at DE and he is coming off a joke of a season. Lots of question still to determined this year and next off season.

Michaelprocton's picture

Wow...

I very rarely see anybody willing to agree with me on that Wharton/Gross point. That's one of the reasons that makes me most angry about the Otah trade. It was way too expensive and I don't think Otah's very good or even capable of playing on the left side at any point in his career, but here's the thing that really gets me: our best line has Wharton as an adequate to above-average LT (remember, he's never played two consecutive years at the same position, either, and he should have improved this year in being one more year removed from his knee injury) with Gross as an All-Pro caliber RT (also with the benefit of playing on the same side in consecutive years.)

As for tagging Peppers, what if he doesn't get an offer he likes better than 1/$16 mil? What if nobody offers for him in a trade? I don't think you can release a guy from a franchise tag, can you? And then we're screweder than anyone has ever been under the cap, paying more than Manning or Brady for a guy who's averaged under 10 sacks a year in his career.

I think there will be a capable starter (this year AND going forward) at DE out of Brayton and Johnson, and I don't even think I'd be upset if they were our projected pre-draft starters next year, because there is plenty of depth. I don't think we really need to worry about McClover garnering a lot of attention as an FA. We might need to put the second-round tender on him just to make sure if he has a decent season, though. Either way, we just can't risk putting ourselves in cap hell for Peppers unless he shows a CONSISTENTLY stellar year. That means 12 sacks in 10 games, not 12 in four.
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Always remember...don't let FACTS get in the way of your argument...

Bubblesthechimp's picture

Wharton > Gross. Better

Wharton > Gross. Better tackle and guard. Why pay Gross more than Wharton?

Panthers wouldnt let Pep sign the tag, just a stall to buy more time. Some team would trade for him, no matter his production. He's still in high regards with most coaches/GMs.

If CJ nails down one DE spot, it still leaves the other. Another 2007 Pep year, will not do it. I agree with putting a second round tender on McClover regardless of production(unless god awful). Next years DE FA pool looks weak, even before teams start resigning there own.

Michaelprocton's picture

Hmmm...

I disagree with the notion that Wharton is a better overall player. Just a better left tackle. Gross is an All-Pro on the right side, Wharton is an All-Pro nowhere.

Panthers wouldn't have any choice in the matter of "letting" Peppers sign the franchise offer. If they offered it, he could sign it at any point forward.
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Always remember...don't let FACTS get in the way of your argument...

Good Move!

My feeling on the move to bring Spencer to Carolina indicates that apparently there could be the possibility of a holdup, in the signing of Off. Tackle Jeff Otah.

Spencer and Otah are relitivly the same in size.
As Camp begins this Saturday, At least the Panthers will work out at the Right Side Tackle spot with somebody as familier in size as is Otah, who is Charles Spencer!

Good Move, until Otah signs!

Spencer and Otah from same school (Pittsburg)

Over the years, the Panthers tend to match players with school when appropriate. High draft pick Spencer is probably a mentor to Otah, if he passes the physical. I agree this is a good move. You never can have too many offensive linemen.

Michaelprocton's picture

Hmm...

The same size, and the same relatively minor injuries that linger for way longer than they should.
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Always remember...don't let FACTS get in the way of your argument...

Michaelprocton's picture

Strange...

He failed a physical with the Texans, but he's supposed to be ready to practice with us. Also mildly concerning, because Riley was the only guy other than Hang with any experience at center whatsoever. Still, if we manage to find at least a decent part-time starter for nothing, it's a good move. I'll assume he was a right tackle?
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Always remember...don't let FACTS get in the way of your argument...

Bubblesthechimp's picture

few weeks ago, Panthers

few weeks ago, Panthers claimed a center. Lasted name Ross i think.......

Team physicals are not a good means of information.

Michaelprocton's picture

You're right...

From the Colts. And as to the matter of the physicals, it's just a concern to me that we would be risking this guy's future health by throwing him out there just because he wants to and he might be able to help us.
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Always remember...don't let FACTS get in the way of your argument...

Not a bad

Smart move. They can keep him on the PUP and work with him to rehab the injury. Cut him at any time. We might not need him until next year, when it is very possible Gross hits the trail. Heck, he is 24--you could get a starting-caliber(albeit rusty) tackle for nothing.

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